Monday, May 21, 2012

Chapter 8

Now we get political. Or do we get anarchy?

22 comments:

Darby said...

FIRST COMMENT!
In this chapter there were politics. Usually the word politics makes me want to go to sleep, but the politics here are more interesting. There are actual backstabbing and scheming involved, with actual blood!
Hrothful also seems like the idealistic child. Always about justice and such. Red Horse is very negative about this though. Anarchist attitude is kinda getting on my nerves. If the government is so EVIl, GET OFF YOUR FAT BUTT AND DO SOMETHING INSTEAD OF WHINING.

Noah said...

I particularly liked this chapter because of the political ideologies and concepts presented, many which I agree with. I mainly like the chapters showcasing cultural development, this being one of them. Hrothulf is also my favorite character so far. His personality is a stark contrast to the other nobles of Hrothgar's kingdom, and his brooding, sulky attitude is a great parallel to Grendel. I find myself even hoping he'll murder the next in line to the throne.
I enjoy how Grendel also observes the burden of kingship. Hrothgar's days are numbered, and he knows it. He is constantly worrying about dead thanes, wars, and Grendel attacking.

sophia said...

I love the two different sides of politic views in this chapter. You have the Socialist and the Anarchist. Red Horse was too funny. Just this little old man going "Screw the government! Let us rise up against them!" It was great, amen bro! This was a solid chapter, I thought. It smoothed nicely and it was different in the way it was done. I liked seeing the contrast of the two sides and all the scenes and poetic verses Grendel used. The new characters added seemed to make things somewhat more intriguing. I also liked Hrothulf as well. His views were very strong, kind, and thoughtful. It seems as if his level of intelligence and consciousness is beyond most peoples. The way he thought about the poor and the wealthy and the way both of them were treated was really smart and sane of him. It showed some more of the evolution of human culture and intelligence in this chapter with Hrothulf and his ideas. Everyone made it seem that the fact that Hrothulf is going to try to take over Hrothgar's rule was a terrible thing but Hrothulf is a great man. He wants some peace and justice which would definitely benefit their kingdom.

Vivi said...

You know, I'm not much of a person for politics, because in the end, politics is a game of selfishness, where everything is majority rules, but for there to be a perfect society, everyone would come together and agree as one, not only thinking of what one favors, but others before oneself.
Grendel isn't as poetic, and I don't even care, because his poetry speaks of himself. Is he realizing there are no words that correlate to his understanding? It's like trying to explain enlightenment. There is no point except to achieve.
His dreams are so beautiful, it's his own mind's creation. I see these visually enraging scenes where the wind is always blowing and there is always a feel of mystery in the air, like Grendel subconsciously understands that there is something so wrong, yet so right about humanity, that Grendel may have started their beliefs,but he was the first domino and he is witnessing his effect. They are spiraling on their own now, moved here and there by his presence.

Anonymous said...

I swear to god only in Grendel is the detailed political chapter a psychological relief compared to the other ones. To go from abstract concepts thrown as fast at the reader as apples at Unferth to the more familiar world of political tangents was a nice break.
It's also interesting to see Grendel develop as a story teller as a result of his obsession with the Shaper and the reality twisting folklore of the humans. The perfect, almost mocking execution of the voice of a human bard he seems to be applying to more and more of his daily life makes him seem less and less sane the farther I read.
-Charlie B.

Evan said...

This chapter was very interesting. In some parts of it, you see Grenadal and his poetic self being, well, poetic. And in th either parts, John Gardner brings in something new, politics. Now, I don't know if this is very boring. (because anything relating to politics is boring). Or interesting because you see Hrothulf's point of view on the government and how it is unfair to poorer people. And hi splint of view is interesting since he may overthrow Hrothgar and his sons to the rule the kingdom. And if he does, there are sure to be changed. I also found this chapter interesting by seeing the similarities between both Hrothulf to Grendal, and the red horse to the dragon. Both Hrothulf and Grendal are young and are strangers to the kingdom and need help from both of their advisors.The red horse for Hrothulf, and the dragon for Gremdal.

Vicenteeee :3 said...

My favorite part of this chapter was reading through Grendel's transitions into becoming a story teller just like the Shaper. He is still becoming more like a monster but is also developing into a storyteller simultaneously. This chapter also showed a lot of political views including the Red Horse who is an anarchist and just wants to see the government go away and never come back. Red Horse is just a peasant though. Hrothulf was also introduced again as Hrothgar's cousin.

Eliana said...

I felt myself rooting for Hrothulf in this chapter. I like how he seems like just a regular teenager, yet everyone knows eventually he'll murder Hrothgar's sons to become king. I hope he does become king and carries out his idea of universal justice. Even though I don't think it will work, I like that it's good he wants peace instead of the hierarchical setup they have now.
I like how the development of human civilization shown throughout the book ties directly to what we've learned in history class. All the way from hunter-gatherers to a kingdom with a government full of nobles (thanes). It's interesting to get the general order in which our civilization was developed and now to get a more tangible example.
I felt really sad for Hrothgar. As much as he was portrayed as an obnoxious, greedy king in previous chapters, he seemed so utterly defeated. All he wanted was this magnificent, grand kingdom, but he got one where many of his own people were conspiring against him and each other. If only everyone was equal, content, and peaceful...

Max Fi$hman said...

This chapter is full of political ideas and shows the development of human kind and how government has evolved. The two political ideas were Anarchy and Socialism. This red horse is a very interesting fellow who finds himself on the Anarchist agenda. He wants the government to be taken down and feels that any type of government is evil. This chapter was very interesting and fun to follow. Its also interesting to hear both political ideas and relate this to human development.

Max Fi$hman said...

This chapter is full of political ideas and shows the development of human kind and how government has evolved. The two political ideas were Anarchy and Socialism. This red horse is a very interesting fellow who finds himself on the Anarchist agenda. He wants the government to be taken down and feels that any type of government is evil. This chapter was very interesting and fun to follow. Its also interesting to hear both political ideas and relate this to human development.

LoReN said...

I'm not that interested in politics but this chapter was more interesting than it seemed at first. Hrothulf's intentions of killing his cousins seem morbid to me, but then his ideas of being fairer to the poorer people instead of always favoring the rich is his good trait. For a teenager, he seems to have a pretty good idea of how to rule as a king. Red Horse was amusing since he was so sure that all systems were evil and wanted to help destroy a government. Grendel didn't do a lot in this chapter except observe and speak in a poetic way, it was a nice break from him attacking people biting off their heads.

Robin said...

I actually really enjoyed this chapter. I really liked how we take a break from looking at it as the story of Grendel, and instead get the telling of Hrothulf and Hrothgar’s story. Only now, Grendel is the story teller. We see him transition and learn from the humans and the shaper and adapt to be the poet himself. I also like the parallel between Grendel and Hrothulf. They are both somewhat angry and depressed and Hrothgar and Wealtheow know that Hrothulf will take over one day the same way that they know that Grendel could kill everyone if he wanted to. Hrothulf even has his own advisor just like Grendel has the dragon. I find Red Horse very funny. He has his own very strong opinions about the way government should be and he expresses it to Hrothulf because he is only a peasant and I think he is hoping that Hrothulf will do something about it.

Sydney said...

The political idea in this chapter is very interesting. In order to get to the top, you have to kill, and you would most likely get away with it if you had the "royal blood." Hrothulf is one of my favorite characters because of his thoughts on the justice system. It's strange to see how Grendel and Hrothulflf are similar to each other, but in a unique way. This chapter has kept me on the edge of my seat waiting to see how the people will react if Hrothulf kills Hrothgar's two sons.

Devon said...

I like this chapter, and my favorite part is when he tries to tell a story/play by himself all in his head. At first I was a little confused, but later I sort of figured it out.

Hrothulf is very socialist. He wants equality, organization, and fairness. Isn't that what everyone wants? Food to be given to poor people instead of rich? All are treated as equal? Well not Red Horse. He has anarchy in mind. We wants to live by his own rules, but it would only lead to disaster. The town would be vulnerable to attack, it would be impossible to make a living, and there would obviously be no structure to the society. Yes the government is evil sometimes, but without it we would be nothing and most likely dead from starvation or being mugged.

Bailey said...

Politics were the main thing going on in this chapter. Grendel did have a good theorem in this chapter, which was if you did something good it will trigger a bad reaction for someone else. What this means is that if you changed something that would then make you happy it will always make someone else unhappy. Also, both Grendel and Hrothulf who is Hrothgars nephew both have advisors. Grendel's advisor is the dragon and Hrothulf's advisor is the Red Horse who is a peasant and also a anarchist. Also Hrothulf and Grendel are both very frustrated, lonely, and they are both outsiders.

Matthew Mannucci said...

In this chapter, I was interested when Grendel says that he created what Hrothgar was and how Grendel also says that him and Hrothgar are like two twisted tree trunks that are twisted with each other. When Grendel says that Hrothgar hasn’t done anything to deserve Grendel’s kindness, I thought that was true and I agree with Grendel. However, Hrothgar did give Grendel meaning in his life, in a similar way to how Grendel gave Hrothgar a chance to be a heroic figure by Grendel being the monster for Hrothgar to go up against. So I think Grendel should have given Hrothgar some credit for that because Grendel does talk about how Hrothgar was Grendel’s “creation.” I just like how Grendel and Hrothgar are supposed to be enemies, and are pretty much enemies, but they both actually really give meanings to each other’s lives. It is different for Hrothgar than it is for Grendel, but it is still there.

Chris said...

This is an interesting chapter to Grendel. Grendel has not (at least not that we know of) been in contact with other humans trying to overthrow Hrothgar. Though the reasons for wanting to overthrow him are different, Grendel and Hrothulf have similar interests. It could be possible to have some kind of contact with each other, and maybe form an understanding of some type.

Dr. Mr. Sr. Eamonn said...

I thought it was interesting that Grendel can figure out who and what builds up politics in human culture without seeing it before. It seems wierd that even though Grendel is a nihilist he still is worried and mad that Hrothgar was built up by him. If nothing really matters, then why does he care if Hrothgar is killed or his line destroyed. He also compares himself to Hrothulf. I think the main reason that they are connected is because Hrothgar has built them both up from what they were and they are both enemies of him. I feel bad that even though Hrothgar doesn't like either of them much but helps them, they hate him in return. It kind of a love and hate relationship for both Grendel and Hrothulf to Hrothgar.

Anthony said...

I like how this chapter starts off with Politics. It shows a lot of political opinions of how the development of human kind started and how government had evolved. These ideas are Anarchy and Socialism. A new character that I thought was interesting was Red horse, who is an Anarchist and wants the government to be taken down. I also liked Hrothulf as well. He talked about the poor and the wealthy. He compared the way both sides were treated.

Cameron said...

In this chapter I like how it makes Hrothulf a more important part, a voice. This chapter shows how much Hrothulf and Grendel are alike. Thinkers.... And also a common feeling of wanting to kill hrothgar.

Cameron said...

I didn't finish

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